Edit: Blocked the author’s name, because it’s not my tumblr. I didn’t expect so many people to misinterpret it and respond in this way.
Edit 2: This is not from the same author, but it’s a reply to them. I think it might help clarify the post for those that are confused:
I normally don’t worry about usernames on tumblr, but since there’ve been some really out-of-pocket misconceptions in the thread, I don’t want anyone to harass them.
Let’s say you magically dissolved Israel. What then? Do you put a different group in power with the Jews still there? Do you deport them? Do you let it be a democracy, or do you need to enforce the leadership somehow? Do you carve up the territory for other surrounding nations like the Kurds? It isn’t an easy problem by any stretch of the imagination.
Plus, Israel won’t be dissolved, it’s very well established now. So calling for it will lead to terrorism hurting civilians and more war rather than that dissolution actually happening.
That one, if I had to choose. But I don’t, it’s the Palestinians that get to decide their own fate. I believe it’s everyone’s right to self-determination.
A lot of people only seem to imagine ethnostates as a solution. I invite those people to ask themselves some questions on why that is.
Looks like there are about 10M population of Israel vs 3M Palestinians in the West bank and 2M in Gaza. (The former number does not include the latter ones, see the wiki link) That would make them badly outnumbered. So it’d still be the Israelis who chose the fate of the Palestinians if you leave it up to a direct democratic vote of everyone in the area of what is currently Israel.
I think a two state solution is ideal. (Though after the attacks I doubt it’s feasible) But a two state solution would likely not be able to be entirely democratic, since the majority Israelis would be able to vote for the oppressive status quo.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Israel https://www.state.gov/reports/2022-report-on-international-religious-freedom/israel-west-bank-and-gaza/west-bank-and-gaza/
Idk if Israelis would be the majority. You would probably have all the Palestinian refugees, whose refugee status is inheritetd, come back. That would be about another 5.6 million. One state would probably lead to complete chaos. And let’s not pretend Palestinians and surrounding Arab states would be kind “overlords”. There is a reason so many Jews from Arab nations fled to Israel.
Who would be able to vote? I was assuming just the people in the area, but yeah that’s another non democratic question.
I agree with your comment on the surrounding states. If Israel was dissolved, it likely would just be consumed by surrounding nations instead of getting self determination.
I regret not making my assumption explicit: a democracy in which there is a just constitution that guarantees the rights of everyone equally. I would not model this democracy based on the USA, because it is such a broken system. In the USA, only one party is in power at a time, which makes problems like the dictatorship of the majority a real concern. Better are European systems where nobody ever gets an absolute majority and always has to form a coalition. It’s of course also not without its problems and I don’t profess to have all the solutions.
What I don’t like is just saying that the two state solution is ideal, but immediately saying it’s not feasible for something the Palestinians have done. This again places the Israeli needs over the Palestinians and disregard the vastly bigger crimes Israel has committed onto the Palestinian population over the years.
I meant politically feasible, (lacks popular and leadership support) not that it isn’t a good solution any more. If a two state solution could magically be established, I do think that’d be pretty good, though it’d be really complex and harry.
Conditional protections against consolidation of power would be great. Ranked choice voting while your at it. But making such a constitution seems like it would still need to be externally encouraged, rather than organically from the will of the majority, since I’d think they’d want to keep more power.
But those sorts of protections I think have been that Palestinians have been advocating more recently over a full separation two state solution, right?
But I want to keep in mind that me and most of us are pretty unformed about the challenges. Arbitrary uninformed lines on maps was how we got into this mess in the first place, with the British mandate coming out of WWI in splitting up the ottoman empire and again after WWII. So even though some degree of external solution may be necessary, it needs to be extremely well informed and thoughtful to not blow up again.