Causing widespread distrust of one of the few means of grassroots information dissemination is an absolutely massive W for bourgeois interests.
LLMs will be the biggest hurdle to proletarian revolution going forward. Having any sort of messaging reach the masses will become impossible, and bourgeois counter narratives will be trivially deployed any time revolutionary moments have the potential to lead to changes that benefit the proletariat.
This is one of the core reasons I have come to the belief that using Chinese platforms will serve us better than using western FOSS projects like the fediverse.
The response to the fediverse has been to coopt, and the response to tiktok has been to outright ban, which clearly implies bourgeois entities believe the former can be used to serve their interests and the latter cannot.
It is clear they feel that Chinese platforms are more resilient to their operations than homegrown open source ones, evidenced by the fact that they can trivially deploy LLM bots to any server or spin up their own.
I dunno, maybe some people will, but I don’t see iPad kids or Grandpa ditching online. With younger people being desensitized to it at a young age the same way they did with crappy apps with microtransactions and weird adverts, and older people not catching on that such a thing would be allowed to happen. Even people who are wise to it might not avoid it, especially as social media becomes more entwined with work, this could be worse than we think.
there have been a bunch of trekkie conversations over the years about justifying the lack of an internet and some other technologies that came to prominence during/after the 1990s in the series and it turns out real life is doing a great job of showing why society might choose to stop having those things.
This is wishful thinking at best and completely delusional at worst.
Internet is required for virtually every aspect of society right now. You think people will stop using the internet when it is required to find a job or hail a taxi? Offline mechanisms to do those things and others are only becoming more rare with each passing day.
Maybe people will give up Facebook, but even believing that is likely is naïve.
This is wishful thinking at best and completely delusional at worst.
This came off as far more hostile and insulting than I intended. Sorry for being a dick.
The human cost of WWIII is even more bleak than the west being lost to neoliberal capitalism forever.
Building dual power is probably the only way to circumvent this, which would necessarily include communication systems. Given that the fediverse is completely vulnerable to LLM spam bots, I don’t think we have the means to implement this via anything that exists now.
Chicken and egg problem with needing to reach people to stir development or get people off proprietary comms systems. I don’t think western left has the juice to do anything required for revolution, and we probably have the deck stacked against our success than most revolutions that have failed.
i’d say “normies stop using the internet” is less out there than the white western left doing a revolution.
You fail to account for the possibility that the white western left does the stupidest revolution imaginable. Doubtful, but a revolution that doesn’t completely threaten bourgeois interests could succeed. Maybe then the conditions could be met for our October revolution.
In reality, neither of these will happen. Only way either of these happen within our lifetimes is if a civil war destroys enough of modern internet infrastructure.
I do see some of this. Its hard to get outside my social bubble enough to get a read on society at large but I definitely see some fraction of younger people being relatively offline and focusing on doing physical things in the real world. I just think that can be kind of a lonely path when many of the structures of society are being remade to push us towards whats online and whats profitable. For every chill offline person I meet I know two people addicted to gambling apps.
Lol I do not believe we are as fucked as this seems, I believe most of us are going to be offline as things like this become more common
The net is over folks, get back to drawing symbols and listening to whatever demon you summoned there
Causing widespread distrust of one of the few means of grassroots information dissemination is an absolutely massive W for bourgeois interests.
LLMs will be the biggest hurdle to proletarian revolution going forward. Having any sort of messaging reach the masses will become impossible, and bourgeois counter narratives will be trivially deployed any time revolutionary moments have the potential to lead to changes that benefit the proletariat.
Yah, it’s also probably another reason why they went against tiktok so hard
This is one of the core reasons I have come to the belief that using Chinese platforms will serve us better than using western FOSS projects like the fediverse.
The response to the fediverse has been to coopt, and the response to tiktok has been to outright ban, which clearly implies bourgeois entities believe the former can be used to serve their interests and the latter cannot.
It is clear they feel that Chinese platforms are more resilient to their operations than homegrown open source ones, evidenced by the fact that they can trivially deploy LLM bots to any server or spin up their own.
I dunno, maybe some people will, but I don’t see iPad kids or Grandpa ditching online. With younger people being desensitized to it at a young age the same way they did with crappy apps with microtransactions and weird adverts, and older people not catching on that such a thing would be allowed to happen. Even people who are wise to it might not avoid it, especially as social media becomes more entwined with work, this could be worse than we think.
:bloomer: maybe there’ll be a reckoning
there have been a bunch of trekkie conversations over the years about justifying the lack of an internet and some other technologies that came to prominence during/after the 1990s in the series and it turns out real life is doing a great job of showing why society might choose to stop having those things.
This is wishful thinking at best and completely delusional at worst.
Internet is required for virtually every aspect of society right now. You think people will stop using the internet when it is required to find a job or hail a taxi? Offline mechanisms to do those things and others are only becoming more rare with each passing day.
Maybe people will give up Facebook, but even believing that is likely is naïve.
if they understand it lead to world war three maybe they wouldn’t rebuild it.
i’d say “normies stop using the internet” is less out there than the white western left doing a revolution.
This came off as far more hostile and insulting than I intended. Sorry for being a dick.
The human cost of WWIII is even more bleak than the west being lost to neoliberal capitalism forever.
Building dual power is probably the only way to circumvent this, which would necessarily include communication systems. Given that the fediverse is completely vulnerable to LLM spam bots, I don’t think we have the means to implement this via anything that exists now.
Chicken and egg problem with needing to reach people to stir development or get people off proprietary comms systems. I don’t think western left has the juice to do anything required for revolution, and we probably have the deck stacked against our success than most revolutions that have failed.
You fail to account for the possibility that the white western left does the stupidest revolution imaginable. Doubtful, but a revolution that doesn’t completely threaten bourgeois interests could succeed. Maybe then the conditions could be met for our October revolution.
In reality, neither of these will happen. Only way either of these happen within our lifetimes is if a civil war destroys enough of modern internet infrastructure.
I hope you’re right
I do see some of this. Its hard to get outside my social bubble enough to get a read on society at large but I definitely see some fraction of younger people being relatively offline and focusing on doing physical things in the real world. I just think that can be kind of a lonely path when many of the structures of society are being remade to push us towards whats online and whats profitable. For every chill offline person I meet I know two people addicted to gambling apps.