i don’t usually comment on this stuff on ‘wild lemmy’ to this depth,
What is this in reference to?
Okay, so in my minds eye, my comment was really for any scientist/stakeholder with an ongoing specific interest in an ongoing green project or something of that nature.
This context was important, thanks. This definitely work on neocons, because they actually care about this country. Unlike fascists, for whom the nation is just a means of implementing their racism. The issue at the end of the day, is that Trump and his cronies he wants to put in the White House are grifters. They know it’s a scam, so there’s nothing to manipulate on the nationalist side for the actual individuals in power. Trump’s a fascist, he probably does believe in some kind of racial superiority for white people. But he has no loyalty to other white people or any people, only himself.
I agree, its murky at best.
I would say what the people in the MAGA movement classify as MAGA is murky. A lot of Trump’s cabinet picks think they are MAGA, but a lot of MAGA people seem to disagree. Trump is one of the elites. He inherited wealth from his dad. If his supporters can spot problems with his cabinet picks why can’t they spot those same problems with him? It’s like the cabinet picks don’t match up with the Trump that lives in their head. Because they definitely match up with the Trump who lives in real life.
I’m definitely uncomfortable classing MAGA as a cult in the traditional sense. Maybe its a movement. My key point here is the strong and continued correlation between Trump voters and Bernie, and AOC voters. This is key in my understanding. It means theres a broad rejection of the status quo.
There’s definitely a desire for populism that rejects the status quo from the electorate. As far as MAGA being a cult, if it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, and shoots lasers from a minigun, then it’s a duck with a laser minigun. MAGA has grown to include attributes beyond a cult. It’s a full christo-fascist movement, but it also still contains the elements of a cult within it. Thus it can still be classified as a cult.
Lastly, appeals to nationalism aren’t MAGAs or fascists, or Conservatives, or what-evers exclusive domain. If your proud of where your from, even if its in the most roundabout ways, then you have some nationalism. Don’t let a words bad reputation hold you back from making the place you love somewhere you can be even more proud of, Liberals, leftists, whatevers can be nationalistic to. Use that USA flag of yours in your own ways, theres no need to cede that shit to authoritarians.
That’s the distinction between patriotism and nationalism. Patriotism being a healthy love of one’s country that can include the belief the country has something worthwhile to offer its citizens and the world. Nationalism being an unhealthy and destructive belief in the country’s superiority that excludes a peaceful or cooperative coexistence with the rest of humanity. We can definitely have and many of us do have a sense of patriotism for our country. There’s no sense in letting fascists claim everything good in the world for themselves. edit: typo
I’s avoiding patriotism, (although also acceptable), because its often a mistake to divide each other apart if its unnecessary. In this case, the vast majority of the US population are not in some MAGA movement/cult. In fact about a third of US voters we can only say have lent these people their votes. However, many more than that would likely accept a nationalistic self image as a fair description of themselves.
I specifically want to counter the idea that to be nationalistic is only a negative thing. Civic Nationalism is a very important thing for countries like ours. The broad designation ‘nationalist’ shouldn’t be surrendered, especially where common perceptions lead to unfavourable results, (see what i say above about likely self images).
Recognition of common interests is also harder if people are speaking different dialects. In this case there is no need to be distanced by that linguistic difference.
By avoiding its use, the broader population can misunderstand civic minded/progressive/left/etc, peoples lack of referrals to ‘nationalism’ as being ashamed of, or hating, their country.
This (dictionary.com) is a good base for the terms. You’re right to assume the negative connotations. Hopefully you see i’s attempting to counter the popular use by pointing out its importance.
In the context of my comment about the US flag, i saw someone paint one of those blue line US flags with the LGBTQ+ rainbow colours. In my opinion civic minded US people should be taking back their flag in those ways more often.
What is this in reference to?
This context was important, thanks. This definitely work on neocons, because they actually care about this country. Unlike fascists, for whom the nation is just a means of implementing their racism. The issue at the end of the day, is that Trump and his cronies he wants to put in the White House are grifters. They know it’s a scam, so there’s nothing to manipulate on the nationalist side for the actual individuals in power. Trump’s a fascist, he probably does believe in some kind of racial superiority for white people. But he has no loyalty to other white people or any people, only himself.
I would say what the people in the MAGA movement classify as MAGA is murky. A lot of Trump’s cabinet picks think they are MAGA, but a lot of MAGA people seem to disagree. Trump is one of the elites. He inherited wealth from his dad. If his supporters can spot problems with his cabinet picks why can’t they spot those same problems with him? It’s like the cabinet picks don’t match up with the Trump that lives in their head. Because they definitely match up with the Trump who lives in real life.
There’s definitely a desire for populism that rejects the status quo from the electorate. As far as MAGA being a cult, if it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, and shoots lasers from a minigun, then it’s a duck with a laser minigun. MAGA has grown to include attributes beyond a cult. It’s a full christo-fascist movement, but it also still contains the elements of a cult within it. Thus it can still be classified as a cult.
That’s the distinction between patriotism and nationalism. Patriotism being a healthy love of one’s country that can include the belief the country has something worthwhile to offer its citizens and the world. Nationalism being an unhealthy and destructive belief in the country’s superiority that excludes a peaceful or cooperative coexistence with the rest of humanity. We can definitely have and many of us do have a sense of patriotism for our country. There’s no sense in letting fascists claim everything good in the world for themselves. edit: typo
Nationalsim v Patriotism.
I’s avoiding patriotism, (although also acceptable), because its often a mistake to divide each other apart if its unnecessary. In this case, the vast majority of the US population are not in some MAGA movement/cult. In fact about a third of US voters we can only say have lent these people their votes. However, many more than that would likely accept a nationalistic self image as a fair description of themselves.
I specifically want to counter the idea that to be nationalistic is only a negative thing. Civic Nationalism is a very important thing for countries like ours. The broad designation ‘nationalist’ shouldn’t be surrendered, especially where common perceptions lead to unfavourable results, (see what i say above about likely self images).
Recognition of common interests is also harder if people are speaking different dialects. In this case there is no need to be distanced by that linguistic difference.
By avoiding its use, the broader population can misunderstand civic minded/progressive/left/etc, peoples lack of referrals to ‘nationalism’ as being ashamed of, or hating, their country.
This (dictionary.com) is a good base for the terms. You’re right to assume the negative connotations. Hopefully you see i’s attempting to counter the popular use by pointing out its importance.
In the context of my comment about the US flag, i saw someone paint one of those blue line US flags with the LGBTQ+ rainbow colours. In my opinion civic minded US people should be taking back their flag in those ways more often.