If you really want the job, this is a bad idea. The form is there so that HR (who usually knows nothing about the technical details of the posted jobs) can match base requirements against what the hiring manager is looking for. If they get a match, they just forward the resume to the manager. Doing stuff like this on the form is likely going to result in them just moving on without looking at your application further. And it doesn’t mean it’s a bad place to work; the company and the manager might be great.
You aren’t. I was just hired for a great position by not filling out their form. Then they emailed me and asked if I wanted to finish. I said “I won’t fill out something that is already on my resume”. They had a couple of interviews and a substantial offer. I started last week.
It depends on the position. If it’s entry level or some retail job, yes, fill it out. But management or some other position where it’s highly specific, this is an absolute waste of my time.
“It depends on the position. If it’s entry level or some retail job, yes, fill it out. But management or some other position where it’s highly specific, this is an absolute waste of my time”
It’s an absolute waste of time, period. No need to stratify it further. McKinsey & Ilk bullshit is commodifying the lowest denominator shit in the name of HR professionals using more buzzwords and less braincells in the hiring process while pretending they’re standardizing equity, in my opinion.
That the positions you are ostensibly qualified for allow for a measure of ‘hardball posturing’ doesn’t mean pseudo-hokey HR practices on non-leadership role hiring. aren’t filtering the best of the best of people–at filling out useless forms that you’ll need to train to critically think anyways.
Only way to combat MBB bullshit is for the in-house managers to grow a spine and speak truth to power after the pre-contractually safe ‘I’m so good you want me even if I don’t toe the line’ that is allowed to every leadership role hire as their moment to feel special to see that reaction.
Also, it’s hard for a computer to parse a resume, and most of this stuff runs through a computer before a human sees it, so filling a form makes sure the data is correct.
You also don’t have to worry about corrupted or unsupported files.
You’re telling me that computers are sophisticated enough to drive cars and create new antibiotics but resumes are just too much? Nah.
If that’s the case then don’t ask for a resume and only have the form to input job history that can be easily handed over to a manager using a printable template.
It’s lazy on HR’s part and on the HR software they use.
Yeah I’m pretty sure you can probably train an AI to do this quite accurately these days, and in fact, someone out there has likely already done that.
The question is whether the company you’re applying to is willing to pay for that. Unfortunately, if does, it would probably also be willing to pay for an AI to replace you as well, and if it isn’t, they’ll likely have you do similarly boring and useless tasks at your job.
You can’t. An NDA prohibits me from saying how I know this, but I know for a fact that advanced and specifically trained FMs still struggle to accurately parse resumes, even with several million dollars devoted to the project.
Really? That’s quite surprising. I understand that it’s not trivial to algorithmically parse a resume formatted for human consumption even though it’s a somewhat structured format, just because the formatting can vary quite a lot, but there’s only so many different types of information on there, and little of it has any overlap in terms of how it could be categorized, so I would think an AI should be quite effective at picking it up.
Then again, I’m not an AI expert and I certainly haven’t attempted to do anything like this.
The models can do alright for very simple resumes, but once you start getting into multiple page ones it gets messy.
While resumes follow a pattern that we’re able to easily recognize, there’s so much variation that even with AI you have to add in a ton of heuristics to control for hallucinations.
The fact that you have people that know nothing about the technical requirements of the role means you have an idiot deciding on whether or not you fit. Your chances are crippled from the get go.
These are red flags to me. This is just a tip of the iceberg and a great indicator as to how dysfunctional the company is.
If you’re THAT detached from the hiring process then you’ll never find a good candidate because you don’t know what a good candidate is.
All that means is that if you some how manage to get hired you’ll be working with idiots that can’t do their job because they were hired by an idiot.
I work for a company that makes rocket engines. It makes no sense to teach the folks in HR about all the disciplines that go into the business - mechanical design, combustion devices, materials and properties, electronics, software, etc. It makes way more sense to make sure they know how to do their own job, and for a hiring manager to be able to tell them something like, “Send me all the applicants who have a computer science degree and at least five years of experience.” Then I can evaluate which of those applicants is the best fit based on the resume. The form facilitate that.
That attitude is precisely the reason why you struggle to find good people. There is no shortage of good applicants. You just don’t know what you’re doing and can’t see the difference.
It’s a real shame. All the more reason why my hatred for corporations grows on a daily basis.
If you really want the job, this is a bad idea. The form is there so that HR (who usually knows nothing about the technical details of the posted jobs) can match base requirements against what the hiring manager is looking for. If they get a match, they just forward the resume to the manager. Doing stuff like this on the form is likely going to result in them just moving on without looking at your application further. And it doesn’t mean it’s a bad place to work; the company and the manager might be great.
Pretty much.
Maybe I’m some rare unicorn. But I have NEVER successfully got a job filling out forms like this. It’s a huge waste of my time.
I’m a hiring manager, and every single person hired at my company has to fill out a form like this.
Then I sneak through the backdoor then, or they fill it out for me.
Again, never have I filled them out and got a job.
And I’m sure you’ve worked enough jobs for your anecdotal experience to be statistically significant.
Places like this probably get 2000 submissions so they are indeed a waste of time.
You aren’t. I was just hired for a great position by not filling out their form. Then they emailed me and asked if I wanted to finish. I said “I won’t fill out something that is already on my resume”. They had a couple of interviews and a substantial offer. I started last week.
It depends on the position. If it’s entry level or some retail job, yes, fill it out. But management or some other position where it’s highly specific, this is an absolute waste of my time.
It’s an absolute waste of time, period. No need to stratify it further. McKinsey & Ilk bullshit is commodifying the lowest denominator shit in the name of HR professionals using more buzzwords and less braincells in the hiring process while pretending they’re standardizing equity, in my opinion.
That the positions you are ostensibly qualified for allow for a measure of ‘hardball posturing’ doesn’t mean pseudo-hokey HR practices on non-leadership role hiring. aren’t filtering the best of the best of people–at filling out useless forms that you’ll need to train to critically think anyways.
Only way to combat MBB bullshit is for the in-house managers to grow a spine and speak truth to power after the pre-contractually safe ‘I’m so good you want me even if I don’t toe the line’ that is allowed to every leadership role hire as their moment to feel special to see that reaction.
I got a job once that was like this, except on paper.
It was 2017.
Also, it’s hard for a computer to parse a resume, and most of this stuff runs through a computer before a human sees it, so filling a form makes sure the data is correct.
You also don’t have to worry about corrupted or unsupported files.
You’re telling me that computers are sophisticated enough to drive cars and create new antibiotics but resumes are just too much? Nah.
If that’s the case then don’t ask for a resume and only have the form to input job history that can be easily handed over to a manager using a printable template.
It’s lazy on HR’s part and on the HR software they use.
Have you ever seen a standard resume?
They don’t exist. Resumes are totally different for every person. Different document format, different layout.
The forms are for filtering. Ones that pass filtering, then the resumes will actually be read.
they aren’t
Not according to every shitty car company with a “social media expert” that makes an OpenAI account
Yeah I’m pretty sure you can probably train an AI to do this quite accurately these days, and in fact, someone out there has likely already done that.
The question is whether the company you’re applying to is willing to pay for that. Unfortunately, if does, it would probably also be willing to pay for an AI to replace you as well, and if it isn’t, they’ll likely have you do similarly boring and useless tasks at your job.
You can’t. An NDA prohibits me from saying how I know this, but I know for a fact that advanced and specifically trained FMs still struggle to accurately parse resumes, even with several million dollars devoted to the project.
Really? That’s quite surprising. I understand that it’s not trivial to algorithmically parse a resume formatted for human consumption even though it’s a somewhat structured format, just because the formatting can vary quite a lot, but there’s only so many different types of information on there, and little of it has any overlap in terms of how it could be categorized, so I would think an AI should be quite effective at picking it up.
Then again, I’m not an AI expert and I certainly haven’t attempted to do anything like this.
The models can do alright for very simple resumes, but once you start getting into multiple page ones it gets messy.
While resumes follow a pattern that we’re able to easily recognize, there’s so much variation that even with AI you have to add in a ton of heuristics to control for hallucinations.
The fact that you have people that know nothing about the technical requirements of the role means you have an idiot deciding on whether or not you fit. Your chances are crippled from the get go.
These are red flags to me. This is just a tip of the iceberg and a great indicator as to how dysfunctional the company is.
If you’re THAT detached from the hiring process then you’ll never find a good candidate because you don’t know what a good candidate is.
All that means is that if you some how manage to get hired you’ll be working with idiots that can’t do their job because they were hired by an idiot.
I work for a company that makes rocket engines. It makes no sense to teach the folks in HR about all the disciplines that go into the business - mechanical design, combustion devices, materials and properties, electronics, software, etc. It makes way more sense to make sure they know how to do their own job, and for a hiring manager to be able to tell them something like, “Send me all the applicants who have a computer science degree and at least five years of experience.” Then I can evaluate which of those applicants is the best fit based on the resume. The form facilitate that.
That attitude is precisely the reason why you struggle to find good people. There is no shortage of good applicants. You just don’t know what you’re doing and can’t see the difference.
It’s a real shame. All the more reason why my hatred for corporations grows on a daily basis.
I don’t struggle to find good applicants. I have a really high success rate in a very challenging field.
just because somebody typed this stuff and took a photo doesn’t mean that’s what they submitted.
Understood, but I didn’t want anyone to think it’s a good idea.