A process that started roughly a year ago with just changing browser and search engine, now feeling that I got somewhere. The journey ended up being more than just degoogle, but also demetaing and taking more control over my data and privacy.
Before and after picture with notes:
Chrome -> Zen browser (Firefox on iOS)
Google -> Qwant
Gmail -> Proton Mail
NordVPN -> Proton VPN (I don’t use VPN very often, but have NordVPN through another subscription, now replaced with Proton across my devices)
Google Drive / Photos -> Proton Drive
Google Password Manager -> Proton Pass
Google Authenticator -> Proton Pass / Ente (Ente Auth is only used to store my 2FA keys for the Proton account, other keys are stored in Proton Pass)
Google Translator -> DeepL
YouTube -> FreeTube (Unwatched on iOS)
Google Maps -> Magic Earth (OSM on desktop)
WhatsApp -> Signal
Notion -> Anytype
Keep / Notes -> Notesnook
X -> Mastodon / Bluesky
Reddit -> Lemmy (Voyager on iOS, dreaming of an eventual complete migration)
Instagram -> Pixelfed
Facebook -> stopped using
Windows 11 -> Ubuntu (Only personal laptop, work laptop still windows)
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I want to use Signal but can’t convince everyone to get on it
Matrix/element doesn’t make you give out a phone #
That’s not why most people aren’t on Signal.
Neither do signal anymore i think
Them dropping sms took away a big carrot for adoption though.
Nope, they still require a number.
From their site:
Requiring phone numbers in Signal lets people see which of their friends they can easily talk to on Signal while limiting the potential for spam within the app.
There are options to spoof a number in the States, and probably some areas of th EU, but many other places are SOL.
They absolutely do, but you can hide that behind a username after you’ve registered now. But you still have to come up with a number to register a new account.
So you start with an iPhone…
Why don’t you put an edgy sticker on it?Gotta start with what you have 🤷
What’s unwatched?
YouTube player app. Open source, no ads, no login, just import your subscriptions and playlists and you’re ready to go.
YouTube -> FreeTube (Unwatched on iOS)
As predicted, here come all the purity tests.
I know there’s no way to definitively prove it, but in my mind Apple is the safer alternative vs. anything Google. I know you can do custom roms and all that, but let’s face it: It’s a huge pain in the ass. I know, I know, “It’s not really”… I beg to differ. I went through my purity phase with degoogled roms and all that. Due to driver inconsistencies, updates breaking things (even the phone part), and the inability to use a lot of “normal” apps, I gave up and went with an iPhone. Apple’s business model is to sell you the thing at a higher price, thus reducing the incentive to sell your data or enshittify. Yes, that will degrade over time and I’ll reach a threshold at which I’ll reevaluate my options. Given the two major choices, I choose the less terrible ecosystem of the two.
I refuse to have any Google or Meta products on my iPhone. I know that makes me lame here, but we should also understand that any normie would never go to all the trouble of OS tinkering. The are a lot more people who want to degoogle vs. the people who understand how to do rom flashing. Criticizing a person’s degoogle effort as “not good enough” does nothing but drive people directly into the arms of the very evil we wish to diminish. This is a community to banish Google, not everything backed by a for-profit corporation.
Apple is the safer alternative vs. anything Google
Not really. Research has demonstrated that iOS and Android send very similar types of data even when users explicitly request to opt out. Apple was even so arrogant as to not bother responding to this paper to explain why.
https://www.scss.tcd.ie/doug.leith/apple_google.pdf
Their platform is also much more hostile towards 3rd party apps than Android, greatly limiting what they can do. This makes moving to FOSS options harder.
Due to driver inconsistencies, updates breaking things (even the phone part), and the inability to use a lot of “normal” apps
Sounds like you haven’t tried modern GrapheneOS with sandboxed GPS. Neither of these are issues for me and I’ve been using it for years after switching from iOS.
The are a lot more people who want to degoogle vs. the people who understand how to do rom flashing
Flashing GrapheneOS takes like 2 seconds and requires nothing but a desktop/laptop and a browser
You know our lawmakers have failed when you have to be this concerned about privacy on your own behalf.
it’s really shouldn’t be this much effort in order to retain your data and I know the argument can be made that you just use services that respect it but without legislation it’s incentivized to monetize data which makes it extremely hard to find alternatives that don’t.
Agreed; unfortunately, this will always happen as long as money is allowed in politics.
My personal choices are slightly different than yours, but I appreciate your comment. You’re clearly an ally while not being a clone. I often tire of discussions about security and privacy—mainly because I am very pragmatic.
Unlike OP I don’t use Proton’s suite, but considered it. Most of what I want Apple provides (Advanced Data Protection, Private Relay, etc) in a form that meets my minimum requirements. Other things that I use (Signal especially) are well-supported on iPhone.
I’ll talk down Apple all day long in the correct context, but I still believe it is a good choice today. I may re-evaluate at some point in the future when the landscape or my needs change. For now I am very happy.
I’ll just leave this here.
Well pick it back up and take it with you, because this issue has nothing to do with privacy. All major vendors take advantage of evil shit to produce their goods.
Nice, now de-Apple it
which of these are apple?
The iPhone
And then de-Proton it.
an imperfect ally is not an enemy
This right bloody here, you have to make sacrifices for peace-of-mind otherwise you’ll live your life paranoid on the smallest of things.
One persons opinions don’t suddenly make a service unusable or unreliable.
This is my thing. I’ve ditched all of proton for the obvious reason, but aside from that, I no longer want everything under one umbrella. Convenience has shown it comes at too great of a cost
I was just about to pay for their service, started a new LLC so that was gonna be a good excuse to start supporting them and then his CEO shows his true colors.
I have been happily supporting Tuta instead. Is a bit slow but the aliases and emails work great.
And then de-Smart it.
I wish there wasn’t a thing such as a 2G 3G shutdown so I can keep using a phone that needs to be charged weekly.
Don’t put all your eggs in one basket (dont use proton for everything)
I usually tell people the same, this is a decision I will have to live with. I am happy with Proton and also happy to support their growth, hopefully it will go well for a long time.
From the other services I tried, Filen and Ente deserve an honorable mention. I was close to just go Mail Plus + Filen + Ente. But as soon as you do Proton Mail + VPN, you then go with Proton Unlimited and that is what makes the most sense financially.
I recommed Tuta for mails. May be not good as Proton but not American, not from Google and most important, private as Proton.
I love Tuta as well, they are great. But not being able to use Tuta with thunderbird was a deal breaker for me. Proton is Swiss btw.
Yeah I know Proton isnt American. Just wanted to remind Tuta’s situation. Yes, lack of another client is really bad but I enjoy the official app, we may differ at that point.
But as soon as you do Proton Mail + VPN, you then go with Proton Unlimited and that is what makes the most sense financially.
That’s how they get you! ;)
Mail and VPN are something I would never want to cross associate, though. After all, any mail provider can see the full contents of any unencrypted email at some point (including Proton), and any VPN provider can see as much as your ISP used to see about your internet activity.
I don’t understand your point, if data will be exposed at some point, why would you want that exposure with 2 separate companies instead of one?
How you liking Voyager? I’m bouncing between Arctic and Thunder atm, one day I’ll find the perfect lemmy client.
Mlem is competent, but isn’t especially good at anything, and lacks some features the others offer
(Not OP)
At the moment I use both mlem and voyager. Personally I find that everyday browsing is a nicer experience using mlem, especially since their recent-ish 2.0 update. Though it’s missing many of the fancier features that voyager has (eg drafting posts). The user tagging voyager has is super useful too.
After coming from Apollo and Reddit, at first I was just unhappy that the clients were not great. Once I moved past my grief state I realized Voyager was good enough. I’ve stopped re-evaluating (though I’m sure I will again at some point) and just appreciate what I have.
I have not tried other clients. I am quite happy with Voyager, but maybe I will give the others a shot :)
Voyager is great but you should give Mlem a shot!
fuck yeah mate
Very good. Next step should be the iPhone
A linux phone is on my list, Jolla or similar. One battle at a time.
I recommed Pixel phones with GrapheneOS or any Lineage OS supporting device. Linux phones are good but I dont personally think they are reliable as smartphone.
Maybe not, but buying them will improve future Linux phones.
Buying a google phone just feels dirty, all this talk about privacy and foss but then still filling Google’s pocket is something we need to move away from as privacy/foss enthusiasts.
Actually, you are right. But IMO, only donating is better for Linux phones. Sailfish OS from Jolla has some problems according to people bought the phone. And other companies are not enough now. Its better not to use smartphone nowadays.
I’d wish, but I my country u have official goverment ID apps that you need for taxes and stuff. Banking, work and school all often require phones. Not using a smartphone is just not feasible for many people, so might as well encourage alt phones like Linux
In Türkiye, we have same things too. My solution is to have a phone ONLY for that actions. No any other apps. Happy with it.
Yeh, I’ve got a second hand iPhone at the minute, but swapping shitty big tech for shitty big tech feels stupid.
Yeah, Linux phones might not be ready yet and it will mean compromises and workarounds. Will be following closely the development of not Google not Apple phones, before pulling the trigger.
Apart from GrapheneOS, all other android ROMs are less degoogled than you think, as confirmed by many security researchers. For less techy people the order to degoogle is:
- iOS as OP did
- android with Universal debloater (likely still contains more google than iOS, as LineageOS, e/OS etc.)
- GrapheneOS on Pixel hardware
Yes, Custom ROMs as OOTB may not be enough. But with root privileges, hardening and debloating solutions, it can be better than iPhones and other options. iPhone will be less “Googled” because it is not Google’s product, but Android is a Google product. So it is possible to label Android as completely “Googled”. However, if we talk about privacy concerns, there are Google services within Android that we can categorize as core and malicious. We can remove the harmful ones as needed, but the iPhone remains a privacy nightmare no matter how few Google products it has. I don’t think the only criterion that defines a secure and private phone is how deGoogled it is. My personal decision is to use any free custom ROM with hardening and debloating.
Apple is a horrible company, for privacy and otherwise, and should be avoided at all costs. And their OS isn’t open source, why trust it?
I might be expressed myself wrong. Because of my poor English😅 I mean, the last step to change is the iPhone. To the Android alternatives with custom OS. Especially Google Pixel phones with GrapheneOS.
How ironic that the ultimate degoogling involves buying a Google Pixel phone! I’d rather go Fairphone with LineageOS.
Ohhh, I didn’t notice that’s an iPhone. Thanks for the explanation, your English is fine, I’m just a bit silly :3
Consider using libretranslate, imo deepl isn’t privacy friendly
DeepL with PWA or browser shortcut is the way for me. LibreTranslate keeps bugging.
Check out kagi translate
Is there anything particular about Notesnook that Anytype doesn’t offer?
Probably not, but I really like Notesnook for its simplicity and just organize notes in folders. Anytype is awesome for more complex stuff, I usually use it for work, kanban boards and such.
That’s fair, I guess there can be a little extra effort in folder/grouping in Anytype and having certain apps that are built for a purpose à la The Fediverse 😄
or Joplin?
I see Proton and Bluesky. Appreciable effort, but it can be done better.
I mean, it the end it’s all up to personal preferences. I’m strongly considering to delete Bluesky due to the latest controversy. But would you care to elaborate?
Not many people have resources to set up a mastadon instance and I don’t think bluesky can be connected using activitypub but I’m not sure about that.
Proton’s ceo has recently made some Trump sympathizer statements but honestly, I’ll still keep my subscription because of how cheap they are for me.
I didn’t like the statements regarding Trump either, but he deleted it and made some comment/post on reddit distancing himself from Trump and right wing politics. So I made peace with that, but yeah, people won’t forget.
Not sure why people care so much, the individual can think whatever he wants, it hasn’t stopped proton from continuing on its good path (even though I don’t use them much nowadays, they are a great service with a respectable free tier).
Trust in a product can be weaponized.
Also, as a Roman, I would never trust a Swiss. Call it genetic memory.
